Dealer Fees

kawachan

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I know I've been seeing a lot of posts, especially C Dolan, talking about crazy dealer fees. I bought a new Z125 last year with no fees...at all!! I have been looking at some small displacement dual sports. I visited same dealer with my buddy Carl about a month ago where he bought a camo KLX 300. No fees and a great price.

I visit a dealer down in Shreveport yesterday to look at a KTM Adventure 390. It's only $6699 retail and the girl finally brings me a quote for $8200 OTD and shows me 450 freight and 150 prep plus tax on the quote. I tell her I'm not paying that much and if they want to sell a bike give me a better price. She comes back and has dropped the bike price to 6399 but price is still $7800 OTD.

I'm trying to figure out how that all adds up. She comes back over with a breakdown and let's me know I can have a copy if I want it.....oh really:smashtard:
Freight. 450.00
Prep. 150.00
Doc. 199.00
Tire waste. 4.50
Title lien. 89.50
Temp tag. 10.00
Notary. 12.00
$914 in fees!! Crazy talk for a 6K bike.

I guess I'll find one somewhere else or buy a KLX 300. It is a much better bike than my cousins CRF 250 L for sure. I may even go look at a CB 500 X or find a KTM dealer that wants to sell a 390 with no BS fees.
 

WarpSpeed

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For those easily distracted by belly button lint and cry TL/DR - tell the dealer to fuck off..

Freight. 450.00 - They need to show you the dealer invoice or shipper where KTM is charging that fee, should be pass through.

Prep. 150.00 - Most, if not all, manufacturers reimburse the dealer for this work

Doc. 199.00 - If you're paying cash and they are doing the title/plate work for you, it's not even 5 documents. $75 tops

Tire waste. 4.50 - Bullshit, you're not disposing of any tires FFS, it's a new bike

Title lien. 89.50 - Super Bullshit, even if there is a loan, there isn't a goddamned fee for this. It's part of what the F&I stooge does for his/her "doc fee"

Temp tag. 10.00 - The only reasonable thing listed

Notary. 12.00 - More bullshit, the F&I stooge is probably the notary, and this falls under what they do to "earn" their "doc fee"
 
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pimpslayer

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These are pure BS...

Prep. 150.00 - dealers are paid by Manufacturer to pdi the bike
Doc. 199.00 - this is always a BS charge...a fee for filling out a few papers
Tire waste. 4.50 - ? - I can't even comment on this.
Title lien. 89.50 - Why is there a lien on a new bike?
Temp tag. 10.00 - tell them to keep it, I always get a metal plate when I stop at the county clerk to register my newest bike.

And did the MSRP on the bike jump since it was released in the fall of 2020? It was $6199 back then.

(I typed most of this out, then went to the bathroom and got a cup of coffee...then came back and posted. I should have been posted about the same time as Warp... :biggrin1a: )
 
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kawachan

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I showed them one on CycleTrader for 5699. I told them my truck has plenty of gas and I'd drive a long way for $1000....much less BS fees. Most show 6199 so I really don't know where they came up with their price. Girl told me they had bought out a dealer from Baton Rouge and had only sold 5-6 KTM's so far. I guess there are at least 5-6 local dummies...

Sales tax was 499 or so. If I paid cash they'd let me pay that on my own. If I financed then it would have to be included as well. So basically the bike was 7300 plus tax...
 

whipit1K

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I have a CB500X for the little woman. It is much more capable than any of the other bikes you mentioned once geared properly
 

Qwik

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I showed them one on CycleTrader for 5699. I told them my truck has plenty of gas and I'd drive a long way for $1000....much less BS fees. Most show 6199 so I really don't know where they came up with their price. Girl told me they had bought out a dealer from Baton Rouge and had only sold 5-6 KTM's so far. I guess there are at least 5-6 local dummies...

Sales tax was 499 or so. If I paid cash they'd let me pay that on my own. If I financed then it would have to be included as well. So basically the bike was 7300 plus tax...
Lien? On a new bike? Daphuq! Tire fees? Tell em no.. Freight? Nah. And they want over msrp. YeahNO
 
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kawachan

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My cousin traded in his 250L for a CB 500X with my prodding 3 weeks ago but I haven't got to check it out yet. I'm interested for sure.

20210507_180407.jpg
 

Vegas12

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CD had mentioned Ride No(w)......dealer has the fees you mentioned and will add "dealer installed accessories" for double or triple the actual cost of the part.

When you axe them to remove the parts, they'll pull the "labor would cost too much" line.

I think I'd mentioned when I bought my F-350 last year I got a decent deal....then F&I tried to slip in the Lo-Crap for some ridiculous price ...($700??).

Told the guy no thanks.

He said it was already installed and that because I knew the owner he was dropping the price substantially.

Explained if anyone steals my truck, I don't want it back....

After some playhouse bullshit and a supposed call to the owner, they removed the charge.

Funny thing is, I never brought the truck back in to remove the already(read never) installed bullshit.

On a side note, Ford doesn't have on-star, but there's some no cost thing that's flat out scary.

It notifies you via a phone app. when your vehicle hasn't been started for a couple weeks and the batteries are down.

Tire pressures through the app. as well as all other data.

I'd imagine they know where the truck is at all times if it were to get jacked.
 
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The Indiana Attorney General is always busting dealers for charging too much in fees.
It's $199 max according to Indiana law. I've received refund checks over this before.

Check local laws, call them on it.
 

Rhino

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Fuck you
NY yamaha is the only dealer here that has zero fees and decent prices..

The jeep I bought in Texas dealer wanted 1500 for glass and tire damage policy that was ONLY good in Texas. Told them truck is going to NY.. if we don't get rid of that fee no deal.. they tried lowering it to 800.. my answer was no and to keep the truck..

they called in two days and waved the fee ... I told them I had a truck closer for $1700 less with same options. He put me on hold and the manager got on and said he will meet that price but I have to finance. Told him nope cash and drive deal, I can be there Thursday. He said would you put down a deposit I said sure.. I put 25k on my Amex card.. (fuck em it's all about the points)

When the finance guy that signs all the psper work over to you seen I put 25k on the card realizing he is eating the Amex fees he said he needs the bank check for the full amount. I put the bank check I brought for the outstanding amount and a SIGNED CONTRACT that his manager and I signed before I left NYC. It stated my deposit and remaining ballance due on pick up...

He was NOT a happy camper.
 

Brokenfly

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I know I've been seeing a lot of posts, especially C Dolan, talking about crazy dealer fees. I bought a new Z125 last year with no fees...at all!! I have been looking at some small displacement dual sports. I visited same dealer with my buddy Carl about a month ago where he bought a camo KLX 300. No fees and a great price.

I visit a dealer down in Shreveport yesterday to look at a KTM Adventure 390. It's only $6699 retail and the girl finally brings me a quote for $8200 OTD and shows me 450 freight and 150 prep plus tax on the quote. I tell her I'm not paying that much and if they want to sell a bike give me a better price. She comes back and has dropped the bike price to 6399 but price is still $7800 OTD.

I'm trying to figure out how that all adds up. She comes back over with a breakdown and let's me know I can have a copy if I want it.....oh really:smashtard:
Freight. 450.00
Prep. 150.00
Doc. 199.00
Tire waste. 4.50
Title lien. 89.50
Temp tag. 10.00
Notary. 12.00
$914 in fees!! Crazy talk for a 6K bike.

I guess I'll find one somewhere else or buy a KLX 300. It is a much better bike than my cousins CRF 250 L for sure. I may even go look at a CB 500 X or find a KTM dealer that wants to sell a 390 with no BS fees.
Alleman kawasaki at bossier city la sold me a new zx11d back in 1996.
 

chuck356

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I am so glad to be out of the this game, many, many variables and a lot of smoke and mirrors, plus a lot of dishonesty on both the part of the dealer and the buyer. First thing, tax laws and fees allowed to be collected vary state to state, so stating what worked for you in Idaho could very well be apples and oranges to what works in Illinois. No uniformity between states.

Then the dealers start playing their number games. (This is a fucking minefield if there ever was one and makes really glad to no longer be a dealer.) Advertise the unit cheap (often dealer cost or below), then start stacking on fees. This is beautiful because a lot of dealers don't disclose the fees until you have told the nice salesman (he said he was my friend.....sob) you are ready to make that machine your very own, them he send you to the depths of hell otherwise known as the F&I office. That great price you got on that machine gets buried under a stack of gobblety gook line items that the sadist across the desk from you ASSUMES you were expecting and uses a bunch of smooth talk (think Obama verbiage) to make you sign your life away. Every now and then, the buyer is actually smart enough to see this and has the balls to walk and call back the other dealer (me) that gave him the honest out the door price to begin with. The majority if them just pull down their pants and take it.

Sadly, these dealers tend to sell more than a guy like me, many buyers chase after what they cannot have. Back ten or so years ago, most people were smart enough and loyal enough to know those too good to be true deals were just that, too good to be true. When someone would say to me "dealer so and so can sell it to me for this", and I knew that dealer's price was bullshit, I would tell the customer that he is bringing a check from the bank and needs to know the exact amount. Some epic fucking back peddling then, or epic lies.

The credit card thing works only if you as the dealer stand firm on the fact that the customer is paying the fees, I always disclosed this early on, I may have even had a sign in the showroom. I had to let a couple walk because of this, but too fucking bad. I generally accepted small deposits on units, so if a credit card fee was involved, it was $10 bucks or less, not enough to worry about.

Time wasters always sucked, after a while you get a 6th sense for them, but a few would fool you. Important questions need to be answered early on in the sales process, it can save hours of time I didn't have to wasted on someone with 390 credit score, or story tellers.

I really enjoyed selling in the '80's, '90's and early 2000's, then it just changed.
 
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First time I saw that tire tax on a new car invoice I looked at my "colored" salesman and asked "what the hell?"
"You voted for him" he said. I didn't vote for him, but it was funny shit.
 

Terry_Schiavo

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I have largely stopped buying used bikes from dealers. Besides bullshit/made up dealer fees, in Illinois there is also huge tax savings if motorcycle is purchased from a private party. Only $25 when purchased from an individual vs 7%+ dealer.
A while back... FL had "impact fees" for vehicles with out of State titles. I paid the fee a few times because it was still a good deal.
Then the State got sued and I got ever penny I ever paid them for this "impact"... it was nice
We still get hosed on private party unless you get the seller to agree to defraud the County/State...lol
At least the value can be stated on the BOS so no DMV lackey can get in the middle of assigning a book value.
 

pimpslayer

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We still get hosed on private party unless you get the seller to agree to defraud the County/State...lol
At least the value can be stated on the BOS so no DMV lackey can get in the middle of assigning a book value.
I had to sign an affidavit a few years ago when I bought a bike with a blown engine...out of state. The clerk at the County Office was leery of the price, and said the State will come after you for the tax on the full Book price if you don't swear this is all you paid.

I just rolled my eyes and signed it...:roll:
.
 

Terry_Schiavo

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I had to sign an affidavit a few years ago when I bought a bike with a blown engine...out of state. The clerk at the County Office was leery of the price, and said the State will come after you for the tax on the full Book price if you don't swear this is all you paid.
I just rolled my eyes and signed it...:roll:.
yeah that pisses me off as a citizen the shit they want to audit... meanwhile dealers are cutting corners in unimaginable ways...
 
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I traded a non titled dirt bike for a car once and went to the license branch asking questions about taxes and such.
They told me if no $ changed hands then it's zero in sales tax.

So now all I ever do is trade things even up.
 

chuck356

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yeah that pisses me off as a citizen the shit they want to audit... meanwhile dealers are cutting corners in unimaginable ways...
In Illinois it's just the opposite, if you are dealer you are under the microscope. Some dealers took liberties I never would and got away with it, but pretty often it bit them on the ass. A big issue we had was people wanting to trade in off-road shit without titles, or jacked up titles. In Illinois, they title everything, it's easier fir them to collect sales tax that way, plus the title fees. And if it is not brand new (as in never retail sold), it is pretty much impossible or very expensive to get a title. I never screwed with the no title shit unless it was real low dollar. Fuckers would buy a MX bike, finance it and not pay it off, then sell it to a buddy. The clueless buddy wants trade the bike in because he doesn't understand he has an essentially stolen motorcycle. Not playing that game, nope.
 

r1racer

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New York State limits dealer's "doc fee" to $75.... New Jersey dealers have no such limit and typically charge $300 or more.....
 
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kawachan

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I just got a call from a dealer in AR I called a few weeks ago. They just received 2 390's. 6699 OTD...no BS fees. I have to pay my sales tax myself, but other than that I just saved myself almost a grand. Its also a 2021 white (the color I wanted) instead of a 2020 black (color I didn't).
 
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kawachan

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So by the time I finally decided to bite the bullet and buy one, the white one was sold. He got 2 more black ones in and one was already gone.. I put a deposit on the last one so they could service it out for me and picked it up yesterday.

My first KTM but probably won't be my last....

20210609_113401.jpg
 
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